| 6/26/2009 10:16:38 PM From: MrsK Grrrr - part tw wn't link http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LN6pmORWeP8&feature=related |  |
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6/26/2009 10:19:06 PM From: ImWithStupid They don't exist in my state.
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| 6/26/2009 10:20:37 PM From: MrsK That's typical. | |
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6/26/2009 10:25:45 PM From: eddo gee, seems if losers would quit breaking the law more prisons wouldn't be needed.
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| 6/26/2009 10:27:13 PM From: MrsK You know, I should know better by now, that people are not going to get this... Nevermind. It is obviously WAY over your empty little heads. | |
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6/26/2009 10:31:16 PM From: ImWithStupid That we should feel sorry for rapists, thieves, and murderers. Yep I probably won't get it.
Sorry if I believe in personal responsibility and consequences of actions. | |
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| 6/26/2009 10:37:32 PM From: eddo tell me I'm wrong MrsK. I would love to hear how... | |
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| 6/26/2009 10:38:50 PM From: ImWithStupid My guess is some kind of "product of society" thing. | |
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| 6/27/2009 5:38:15 PM From: BCAR any kid in America can wake up one morning and swear, "I will never see the inside of a prison my entire life." And he can do it too. just stay out of trouble, stay away from criminals, and obey the law. |  |
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| 6/27/2009 6:02:30 PM From: MrsK The fact is gentlemen, that when you allow the major corporations to make a profit from incarcerating human beings, and allow those same corporations to lobby for harsher laws, someone stands to get paid. When people stand to get paid (our great capitalism at work) and quality control is not a big issue (because these people have been shucked aside) the great justice system by which you all SWEAR by, becomes extremely corrupt. No longer are people INNOCENT unitl Proven Guilty my little darlings. Oh no. Quite the opposite. | |
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| 6/27/2009 8:54:46 PM From: whogo Well, Miss DXumbass, the corporations ain't the runs sending them to jail. It is a jury of their peers. Also, Miss Dumbass, it is the legislature that makes the laws, and guess what?, scumbag criminals got their supporters too. | |
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| 6/27/2009 8:56:08 PM From: whogo The fact is most of us support lengthy imprisonment of homicidal maniacs. Of course, most of us ain't married to one. | |
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| 6/27/2009 9:08:42 PM From: whogo That broad looks like a methhead. Kill her. | |
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6/27/2009 9:28:07 PM From: MrsK Hugo you fuking moron. you are apprantly still not letting this sink into that pea sized brain of yours.
Let me dumb it down YET AGAIN; When you allow a CORPORATION (that is a really big company with lots of Money and usually run by a bunch of rich white guys) to earn a Profit (something that happens when your business does well) from incarcerating human beings (a species that has the capacity to be ingelligent but somehow left you out in the cold) and these same companies can send lobbyists to push for harsher sentences and laws, the focus NO LONGER REMAINS WHO IS INNOCENT - the focus then becomes GET AS MANY IN THE DOORS AS POSSIBLE SO WE CAN KEEP MAKING MONEY.
Please don't bring my family into this. My husbands situation falls WAY outside the boundaries of privatized institutions. At any rate he is my family, and I don't appreciate your attempt at reviving that same dead horse. | |
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6/27/2009 9:30:59 PM From: Ali It's the liberals who feel that Americans can't take a shit without the government approving it that are clamoring for stricter laws.
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| 6/27/2009 9:31:07 PM From: MrsK In other words there is no concern as to whether a human is innocent or guilty ina crime, the whole idea behind the system is to lock them up so some white shirt can continue to cash in. Before you continue this I would highly suggest actually WATCHING the video. | |
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| 6/27/2009 9:31:55 PM From: MrsK I repeat - Watch. The. Video. | |
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6/27/2009 9:33:39 PM From: Ali Weren't you just demanding a harsher penalty in the case of the kid being drug by a noose and insisting on jail time?
Do you own a prison?
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| 6/27/2009 9:34:11 PM From: MrsK The same liberals Ali who are against the death penalty? Seems mighty counter productive to me. Be realistic, why would those same indiviual rights mongering monsters want to enforce stricter laws and sentences? | |
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| 6/27/2009 9:35:51 PM From: MrsK That's because there is a difference between justice and bullshit. Several of you agreed yourselves that a crime of that degree waranted a harsher punishment than 10 days in jail. Common sense is enough of a tool to figure that one out. | |
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6/27/2009 9:38:24 PM From: ImWithStupid Bull!
MrsK when you spend some time prosecuting sh!tbags who commit crimes, and proving to ignorant juries that watch CSI, what the difference between beyond a reasonable doubt and beyond all doubt, is or have to explain to the victim of a rape or whatever that just because they saw some sh!theel run away from their vehicle when the alarm was going off, doesn't prove they stole their stereo. Once you actually fight all the fukking rulings that place all the rights in the hands of the sh!tbag that commits the crime and leaves the victim high and dry, then you can make some fukking BS claim that people aren't innocent until proven guilty.
I have to go way beyond what is fukking reasonable to common sense to get the stupid populace that occupies a jury to know that some sh!tbag commited the crime they committed.
I mean any more when the fukk and the guy he was with admit they did it, it isn't enough.
When you get some fukking practical experience dealing with this, then we'll talk.
I truly believe that being a defense attorney, is the easiest job in the world. The criminals have the advantage. In fact most of the attorney's that sukk move on to being defense attorneys because it's easier. | |
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6/27/2009 9:39:53 PM From: ImWithStupid Replace "rape" with "theft".
I will get into the rape victim's plight if you want to. They are the worst off. | |
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6/27/2009 9:40:24 PM From: MrsK I am on my way out the door. I implore you, before you go off on a tangit about pointing fingers at liberals and democrats or conservatives etc. Watch the god damned video.
When one out of every one hunred Americans is behind bars, when the U.S. houses 2% of the worlds population, yet 25% of the worlds inmates - something is terribly wrong people. It is a damned shame that people have to find themselves int his situation before they can see. I was once where you are now - "frack criminals, enforce the death penalty, prison wives are out their minds" ... I am no speaking from passion alone but from experience. | |
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| 6/27/2009 9:43:16 PM From: MrsK Easier? Ok, I gotta go. I am late. I'll fill you in on my experience IWS in a few hours. I'll start with my paralegal degree earned by working closely with a state attorney - (prosecutor), my time volunteering at the courthouse with both state prosecutors and the public pretenders office. K? | |
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| 6/27/2009 9:56:54 PM From: ImWithStupid When your experience surpasses my decade of experience seeing sh!tbags walk on slam dunk cases, because of dirtbag attorneys, with no fukking guts and the fact that criminals have all the rights, then we'll talk. | |
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6/27/2009 10:21:24 PM From: eddo 10 points for IWS's spot on comment at 6/26/2009 10: 38: 50 PM.
He'd get more, because he was right, but seriously- the level of difficulty in calling that one didn't account for much. 
I'll say that I don't see a problem- at this point- for corporations making money off of prisons. People that work at private or state run prisons now make money off of those incarcerated there. The simple fix is this:
People stop breaking the law, these folks go outta business. pretty darn simple if you ask me. | |
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| 6/27/2009 10:27:14 PM From: ImWithStupid Exactly. Unless the same corporation that is housing the dirtbag "for profit", is the same entity that commits the dirtbag to incarceration, there isn't a problem. | |
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6/27/2009 10:43:55 PM From: ImWithStupid The video, shows these things.
1. Women shouldn't be in law enforcement or corrections because they are physically inferior to handle violent incidences. Blame the women's rights groups and the ACLU.
2. Criminals attack corrections officers which shows the dirtbag should be in prison.
3. Private companies running corrections institutions are more efficient and save taxpayer money unless some woman who thinks she can do a man's job, gets hurt and sues the company.
4. The riot argument is crap. I can point to several riots worse than this that occurred in federal prisons and other state run prisons, that were staffed by people who were trained in the most recent techniques in corrections. I currently work with people who have been in both the private and public corrections facilities in not only Nebraska, but Texas, Wyoming, South Dakota, Iowa, Arizona, Nevada and Colorado, who say this video is crap. | |
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| 6/28/2009 8:25:34 AM From: whogo Corporations are great, one of them sends me a paycheck every two weeks. | |
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6/28/2009 8:28:03 AM From: whogo Underlying most arguments against the free market is a lack of belief in freedom itself.
Milton Friedman
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| 6/28/2009 8:28:47 AM From: whogo Someone needs feed that scrawny broad. | |
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| 6/28/2009 8:37:13 AM From: whogo I am in favor of reducing the size of our prison system by ending the drug war. | |
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| 6/28/2009 9:37:39 AM From: whogo What the dumbass liberal fails to understand is government bureaucrats have their insiders fighting privatization every step of the way. These bureaucrats have managed to destroy our school system. We are now sending a bunch of ignoramouses out into the world with a high school diploma that ain't worth the paper it is printed on thanks to our public schoolsand the stinking liberals who will not allow a voucher system. | |
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6/28/2009 10:12:38 AM From: BCAR Let me get this right
A kid who puts a rope around another kids neck and scares him deserves lengthy jail time and a couple million dollars.
A murderer who happens to be a minority should get off easy because he is a minority.
Prisons shouldn't be run by private entities because they might actually provide better value than government run corrupt agencies.
If the government runs a prison convicting someone is one thing but If it's for profit corporations its greed.
If someone has a company and employs people and actually makes a profit that's a bad thing.
However companies that make money pay taxes and ones that are unsucesfull do not. However at some point someone has to make money and pay taxes so that scumbags can suck off the government.
There sure are a lot oh holes in your worldview MK. | |
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6/28/2009 1:22:16 PM From: MrsK IWS - your decade of "experience" is fine and dandy. I wouldn't dream of telling you that I have SO much more experience than you, because I realize you have hands on experience dealing with criminals. Ok, that's all fine and good. I have experience not "Watching" it, but taking part in the case research, seeing the HUGE difference between what is given - flatly given - to the prosecution and what is made reluctantly available to the defense (specifically public defenders). Our government spends ten times more on the prosecution, than it does the defense. I am not the cop who cuffs the bad guy and sends them to jail to wait for trial, I am the one who gets all the information prepared for trial so that an attorney (who by the way doesn't DO case law research or paperwork prep) doesn't get up there and make an ass of him/herself.
I also worked in the prison system, and the juvenile justice system and you know what - I am not a complete idiot - I DO realize that there are bad people who do bad things, and they need to be put away for our protection - BUT I am NOT so stupid to turn my head and say that everyone in prison/jail/JJ DESERVES to be punished because they did something bad and they are ALL guilty and should be cast out. If I can look at it from both sides, I you should certainly be able to as well. | |
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| 6/28/2009 1:24:16 PM From: MrsK "I currently work with people who have been in both the private and public corrections facilities in not only Nebraska, but Texas, Wyoming, South Dakota, Iowa, Arizona, Nevada and Colorado, who say this video is crap." If you and all these guys were just sitting around watching this video on the clock - you should all be fired. | |
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6/28/2009 1:29:15 PM From: MrsK BCAR Eddo - I don't know how much more I can dumb it down for you. Do you not realize that when someone stands to get paid for incarcerating people they will not care whether they are incarcerating innocent people or guilty people? Can that concept not find it's way through your thick little skulls?
Not Breaking The Law seems SO EASY! I've never done it! But guess what guys? You can't march an innicent person into a courtroom in front of a jusry in handcuffs and leg irons. Because whether they broke the law or not, those cuffs, those leg irons tell the jury one thing - This Man/Woman Is Trouble. Tell me, what do you think when you see someone in handcuffs? I can answer that for you - Lawbreaker, Troublemaker, Criminal.
Yet from HCI we have released three men this year who served EXTREMELY long sentences and were later proved innocent. One of them I even posted a story about here. He served something like 20 years of a life sentence on a murder charge, for the state to say Twenty YEARS later "Ooops!" | |
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6/28/2009 1:32:26 PM From: MrsK "A kid who puts a rope around another kids neck and scares him deserves lengthy jail time and a couple million dollars." BCAR have you zero integrity behind those nimble little fingers when you type?
A. He did noty put a rope around a kids neck and scare him. He dragged another kid around the parking lot BY THE NECK. As I said in that post, lets do it to you and see how much of a joke you think it is. Or better, how about one of your kids.
Gotta run - be back to discucc later. | |
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6/28/2009 1:50:41 PM From: MrsK One year for assulting a minor is not lengthy sentence - it is justice.
Who asked for millions? Where are you getting this from? | |
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6/28/2009 3:23:21 PM From: BCAR His mommy sued the city remember? And private prisons do not have any say as to who gets sent to them. Who's small mind came up with that.
Your world view is fom that of paranoia and victimhood. All self induced. | |
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6/28/2009 4:12:04 PM From: Ali My new goal is to own a prison so I can get harsher laws passed(hopefully targeting minorities!) in order to gain more "customers".
I'm sure I'll be on Forbes Fortune 100 list in no time! | |
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| 6/28/2009 4:31:44 PM From: MrsK Yes the parents are suing, I never said are that was a wonderful thing though. So why are you insinuating that I supported that idea? | |
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6/28/2009 4:38:02 PM From: ImWithStupid From MrsK: "Our government spends ten times more on the prosecution, than it does the defense."
No Sh!t. It's because the burden of proof is on the prosecution and the game is increasingly rigged in favor of the defense. | |
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6/28/2009 4:38:26 PM From: MrsK I guess you didn't watch the program. It gives the factual evidence and the names of the corporations that already have the lobbyists working for them. Self induced? Victimhood? Because I presented you with a factual source that explains in plain Engligh how these privatized institutions work?
Hey, you wanna keep your little blinders on that is all on you. I can't make you stop being ignorant about what's happening.
Just remember - The U.S. represents 2% of the worlds population, and 25% of the worlds incarcerated people. That's one in every one hundred Americans behind bars. And still growing. I did the math for you, I gave you the evidence. If you want to put your fingers in your ears and sing lalalalal, I can't make you listen. Oh Well. | |
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| 6/28/2009 4:42:42 PM From: whogo We could save a lot of money if we just expedited and expanded executions using a couple .22 shells to the back of the head of anyone convicted of an armed assault, rape or murder. Holes in their heads! | |
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| 6/28/2009 4:43:36 PM From: MrsK Gee Hugo, that's what they do in China. I thought you strictly dissapproved of communism. | |
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| 6/28/2009 4:43:46 PM From: whogo The fact is ya take a knife to someone ya gonna rot in prison. | |
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6/28/2009 4:45:50 PM From: MrsK Hey BCAR I want you to remember that you are one of the people in favor of people keeping the power. A quote from this short c/p "Privatization, however, abrogates this power of the people. The corporation builds the institution and the government leases it." (borrowed from http://www.afscme.org/publications/2548.cfm)
Financing for Private Prisons Eliminates Public Accountability
Table of Contents
Traditionally, correctional facilities have been financed through tax-exempt general-obligation bonds that are backed by the tax revenues of the issuing governmental body. This debt requires voter approval. Privatization, however, abrogates this power of the people. The corporation builds the institution and the government leases it. The cost of the facility then comes out of the government's budget, avoiding the politically difficult step of raising debt ceilings. Once the lease payments have fulfilled the debt, ownership of the facility shifts to the governmental body, thus completing an end run around the voters.
This arrangement leaves the government entity completely liable for failed performance by the private prison operator. This was the case in 1988, when Dallas-based Detention Services Inc. persuaded Zavala County, Texas, officials to finance a private prison with county bonds to be repaid from prison revenues. The private operator then signed a contract with the District of Columbia to house prisoners. But in December 1990, the District canceled its contract, citing prisoner escapes, fights by bat-wielding inmates, and an instance in which a guard drove two inmates 50 miles to visit a brothel in Mexico. With the prison empty and no revenue coming in, the county was forced to make bond payments out of its operating fund. The county incurred a budget deficit and defaulted on its bonds.22 The taxpayers were left to pay for the entrepreneurs' mistakes.
Texas "big six" private prison scandal.
In 1988, brothers Michael and Patrick Graham incorporated N-Group Securities and, with the lobbying efforts of a former governor and other local power brokers, convinced six counties to float $74 million in tax-exempt bonds to build private prisons. The company sold the county officials on the plan to use county-backed bonds after it paid county attorneys to "review the bond contracts." By October 1989, the bond scheme had made the brothers millionaires. The Grahams tried to influence changes in state policies so their private cells could house Texas inmates, but the jails turned out to be a bust. Investors sued the N-Group for $7 million.
With the bonds about to go into default, N-Group began pressuring the state to buy the jails. Although state corrections officials concluded that the jails were substandard, the state eventually voted to purchase the facilities for $6 million each. According to one member of the Criminal Justice Board, "the purchase of these facilities is nothing but a bailout of the counties seduced by snake oil salesmen."23
REIT Financing
Another trend in private prison financing involves the private firm raising capital by issuing stock, taking advantage of a tax-advantage investment structure called a Real Estate Investment Trust, or REIT. Both CCA and Wackenhut created REITs in 1997, and promptly "sold" the prisons they already owned to the REITs. REITs have been called the next milestone in prison privatization by industry experts. They allow the private firms to get the prison properties off of their books, thereby freeing up venture capital for additional prison privatization projects. However, a jurisdiction's contracting relationship is with the management company and not the REIT. The REIT could, in turn, resell a prison to make a profit. Profit, not the local taxpayers, determine who owns a prison.
Financing prisons through REITs and other private mechanisms allow public officials to get around democratic controls over public capital investment decisions. These democratic controls, such as bond referenda, debt ceilings, and capital budgets ensure that public officials do not make large commitments of public dollars without demonstrating to the public the need for these commitments. These democratic controls are necessary to protect taxpayers.
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22 Todd Mason, "Its A Bust: Many For-Profit Jails Hold No Profits — Nor Even Any Inmates; Still Promoters Keep Pushing Privately Run Prisons to Job-Hungry Towns; Texas Rent-A-Cell-Breakout," The Wall Street Journal, June 18, 1991.
23 Kathy Fair, "Prison Board Votes To Buy Private Jails," Houston Chronicle, April 11, 1992; `Brother Walk Fine Legal, Financial Line," Pecos Enterprise, October 13, 1997.
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| 6/28/2009 4:51:27 PM From: MrsK BTW - aother interesting fact from this show is that the privatized institutions when they do not get their way, threaten to RELEASE criminals (many of them dangerous) into society without having completed their sentences. Just another FYI. | |
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6/28/2009 5:59:00 PM From: ImWithStupid From MrsK: "Just remember - The U.S. represents 2% of the worlds population, and 25% of the worlds incarcerated people. That's one in every one hundred Americans behind bars. And still growing. I did the math for you, I gave you the evidence. If you want to put your fingers in your ears and sing lalalalal, I can't make you listen. Oh Well."
And your "data" and "math" like many statistics, doesn't really mean crap. There are nations all over the world that don't incarcerate people. They either cut off a body part, whip or flog the accused without due process or just kill them.
We don't do that. | |
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| 6/28/2009 6:09:52 PM From: whogo In Texas we have something called a parole board that decides when prisoners get released, it does not matter whether the institution is private or public. If you are telling me that private institutions have the power to determine when someone is released from prison I need a source. The fact is about the only difference between private and public prisons is whether the employees are employed by the state or a company. | |
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| 6/28/2009 6:13:30 PM From: whogo The fact that government is so inefficient they often screw the taxpayer, whether they waste money on contractors or state employees, is not exactly news. | |
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6/28/2009 6:17:02 PM From: ImWithStupid From MrsK: "If you and all these guys were just sitting around watching this video on the clock - you should all be fired."
Because it's not possible that this was only two people who have worked in many places around the country and they couldn't have been checking this out by me talking to them over the interwebz, as opposed to us "sitting around watching the video".
As far as me being fired and what I can and can't do at work, unless you sign my paycheck, shut the fukk up. | |
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| 6/28/2009 6:18:16 PM From: whogo Let us just end the drug war and we won't need to worry about housing so many prisoners. | |
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| 6/28/2009 6:22:09 PM From: whogo The fact that government workers are able to sit around and watch videos, i8nstead of doing their jobs, is another argument for privatization. Just kiddin' ya, IWS. | |
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| 6/28/2009 6:39:13 PM From: MrsK Hugo - all the sources you need are listed in the 2 parts of this video. | |
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| 6/28/2009 6:39:56 PM From: Ali You can take this any way you want to, MrsK, but I will respect the views on this subject from someone like IWS who is actually out on the street and puts his life on the line dealing with law breakers and the harsh reality of the damage they cause rather than someone who reads a lawyer's transcripts about yet another criminal becrying his/her innocence and then passes idealogical judgements from the safety of her desk. | |
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| 6/28/2009 6:45:11 PM From: whogo The fact is, MrsK, private institutions have no power to incarcerate, or release, anyone, unless authorized by the state. | |
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6/28/2009 6:45:49 PM From: Ali The U.S. represents 2% of the worlds population, and 25% of the worlds incarcerated people. That's one in every one hundred Americans behind bars. And still growing.
That means we are raising a bunch of nitwits who feel entitled to do and have whatever the hell they want and are breaking society's laws because of it!
People aren't just strolling down the street and suddenly being tossed into the clink willy nilly. You actually have to DO something illegal and be convicted by a jury for said illegal activity to get there. Last I heard, "innocent until proven guilty" was still in play in the American judicial system. | |
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6/28/2009 6:46:47 PM From: MrsK Ali - I understand why you would put your faith there, but allow me to correct you in something. I don't read a lawyers transcripts, I create them. Well, not now, but have in past position(s). A paralegal does not merely read the transcripts, they actually interview witnesses, victims, and defendants. Basically I can do anything and everything an attorney can do save for two things; 1. I can NOT gve legal advice. 2. I can NOT represent anyone in a court of law, save for in some states that allow paralegals to represent in lesser courts over civil matters.
We conduct investigations, file multiple RA's for evidence etc etc etc.
I'm not saying I am an expert, but give a little credit where it is due. When there is work for me (and even when there isn't and I am volunteering at the PD's office) I bust my ass. And it is rarely from behind a desk. | |
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6/28/2009 6:52:20 PM From: MrsK No Ali, Innocent until proven guilty is a pretty little phrase they use to make a flowery appearance. It does not apply, and hasn't for a very long time. I am sure if you went in search of evidence of that, you would find it.
And if you HAVE TO do something wrong to get into prison, why don't you tell that to the people who are being released every day due to "New" or "Never Investigated Evidence" that sets them free after they've lost half their lives or more behind bars. I personally know quite a few of those as well. I can not express to you in enough ways that no, you absolutely do not have to do anything wrong to get into prison these days. Does that mean I believe everyone behind bars is innocent - of course not. It just means that I am willing to recognize that there are a lot of people who are. | |
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| 6/28/2009 6:58:04 PM From: MrsK " The fact is, MrsK, private institutions have no power to incarcerate, or release, anyone, unless authorized by the state." Hugo my darling, let me clue you in on something. A simple little warden (Now - this is Florida - I don't know about your state) can decide he wants to release anyone he wants, with the exception of death row inmates. It never happens, and it has only happened once or twice in the last 100 years, and it extremely frowned upon, but yeah - a warden can make that decision. If you actually took the time to watch the video - which I realize would be hard to do and actually learn something new - you would know that the private institutions have threatened to close their doors and release dangerous criminals into the streets if the state did not increase their $$$. It's all int he documented evidence I have put right in front of you. | |
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| 6/28/2009 7:00:14 PM From: MrsK I also go to court and participate in trial proceedings by helping attorneys keep thier shit straight. | |
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6/28/2009 7:46:48 PM From: ImWithStupid From: whogo The fact that government workers are able to sit around and watch videos, i8nstead of doing their jobs, is another argument for privatization. Just kiddin' ya, IWS.
Too bad I haven't been at work since this BS video was posted. 
I don't work weekends unless I get called out. | |
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6/28/2009 8:02:30 PM From: ImWithStupid From: MrsK "IWS - your decade of "experience" is fine and dandy. I wouldn't dream of telling you that I have SO much more experience than you, because I realize you have hands on experience dealing with criminals. Ok, that's all fine and good. I have experience not "Watching" it, but taking part in the case research, seeing the HUGE difference between what is given - flatly given - to the prosecution and what is made reluctantly available to the defense (specifically public defenders). Our government spends ten times more on the prosecution, than it does the defense. I am not the cop who cuffs the bad guy and sends them to jail to wait for trial, I am the one who gets all the information prepared for trial so that an attorney (who by the way doesn't DO case law research or paperwork prep) doesn't get up there and make an ass of him/herself."
My years of experience also lets me know that your claim of reluctance, is BS. Everything is available to the defense if they ask for it.
I too research case law. I'm not just a traffic cop. I investigate major crimes. If I build a case on you, it's because you committed a crime and the odds that you will get off are next to nothing. I research case law too and often present the cases along with my reports to the prosecutor, so that my case that I painstakingly built wouldn't be pissed away because of some lazy ass prosecutor.
Even though the deck is stacked for the sh!tbag, if I send a case to the prosecutor or place you under arrest. You're likely to see the inside of a prison or at least be tagged a felon.
Local defense attorneys have actually bitched about taking on cases of mine because it's likely they won't be able to rack up billable hours because there won't be anything to argue or suppress. I was talking to one attorney who took on a defendant in a case I sent up and referred to himself as a "whore".
Now if you want to talk about a sham business that is full of low moral dirtbags, lets talk about attorneys.
Many of the most ignorant, stupid people I have met are attorneys and that's the state of the industry. Unless you went to a major University, it's likely that your law degree was obtained like a puppy mill pumps out puppies. If you're willing to pay for the degree, then you are likely to get it. | |
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6/28/2009 8:18:03 PM From: ImWithStupid From: MrsK " The fact is, MrsK, private institutions have no power to incarcerate, or release, anyone, unless authorized by the state." Hugo my darling, let me clue you in on something. A simple little warden (Now - this is Florida - I don't know about your state) can decide he wants to release anyone he wants, with the exception of death row inmates. It never happens, and it has only happened once or twice in the last 100 years, and it extremely frowned upon, but yeah - a warden can make that decision."
Does this apply to private run prisons? I'm guessing that this is a power limited to government run prisons, if it is true. Essentially making your point, moot, unless private run prisons have the same power. | |
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| 6/28/2009 8:25:04 PM From: whogo She is lying again. A warden has no power to release prisoners in any state in the union. | |
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6/28/2009 10:23:46 PM From: Ali "I'm not saying I am an expert, but give a little credit where it is due. When there is work for me (and even when there isn't and I am volunteering at the PD's office) I bust my ass. And it is rarely from behind a desk."
I'm not implying that your career choice is cake or that you don't give 100%. What I AM saying is that you and IWS (based on your respective jobs) are seeing criminals from two different perspectives. His viewpoint is based on action and first hand exposure to the situation whereas yours is centered on clerical technicalities and theory.
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6/28/2009 10:58:47 PM From: eddo people should really stop stealing the....
69!! | |
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| 6/29/2009 4:02:00 AM From: MrsK "Now if you want to talk about a sham business that is full of low moral dirtbags, lets talk about attorneys." Alas... Something we agree on. Any business that will pay an employee $15-20 an hour for services they charge the customer anywhere from $100-300 an hour for has no morals. | |
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6/29/2009 4:06:07 AM From: MrsK Really Hugo? Why don't we look up Paris Hilton a few years back, and see if we can't finds a lovely little story about a Jail Warden releasing her before her sentence was up eh? That was just a jail, the warden did not lose his job because he was within his rights to do so.
Here Hugo - here is another example. I don't necesarily agree with the story, but the title reads: Federal Prison Warden Denies Inmate Early Release to be with Dying 10-year-old Daughter
That wouldn't be an issue if a warden couldn't make that decision now would it? | |
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6/29/2009 4:20:29 AM From: MrsK I am thankful this police officer on lost six years. So much for the notion that you HAVE TO do SOMETHING wrong to end up in prison, lol.
http://www.november.org/stayinfo/breaking3/AbuseHearings2.html
This is the full story.
April 20, 2005 - The St. Petersburg Times (FL)
Former Warden Recounts Abuses In Florida Prisons
The National Commission Hears Allegations Of Beatings And Sexual Assaults In Prisons In Florida And Elsewhere
By Curtis Krueger, Times Staff Writer
Return to Drug War News: Don't Miss Archive
TAMPA - "Goon squads" of guards roam Florida's prisons, beat up inmates and enforce vigilante justice while the top brass turns a blind eye, a former state Department of Corrections warden told a commission on Tuesday.
And many others among 2.2-million incarcerated Americans suffer such abuses as rape, unneeded strip-searches and inadequate medical care, members of The Commission on Safety and Abuse in America's Prisons were told Tuesday in Tampa.
This slew of abuse "doesn't fit with the core values of our democratic society and therefore, should trouble all Americans," said commission co-chairman John J. Gibbons, former chief judge of the 3rd U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals.
"Everyone in society suffers" because of such abuses, said former U.S. Attorney General Nicholas Katzenbach, another co-chairman.
This nationwide commission is a privately organized but high-profile group whose members include former FBI director William S. Sessions; Iowa Deparment of Corrections director Gary Maynard; and former Arizona death row inmate Ray Krone, who was exonerated based on DNA evidence. The commission is supported by a consortium of foundations and law firms, and uses the staff of the Vera Institute for Justice, based in New York.
The commission plans four sets of hearings around the country; Tampa's is the first. The two-day hearing continues from 9:15 a.m. to 1:15 p.m. today at the offices of WEDU-TV, 1300 N Boulevard, Tampa.
Commission members made a point to say corrections officers generally are professional and honest. As the commission studies problems in jails and prisons, "we aim to work closely with corrections professionals every step of the way," Katzenbach said.
But before long Tuesday, commissioners were listening to stories of what has gone seriously wrong in some prisons and jails.
Ron McAndrew, who served as warden at Florida State Prison and two others, said his 23-year career showed him prisoner abuse in the state Department of Corrections "was systematically chronic. The large prisons were plagued with "goon squads' that were well known to, and feared by, staff and prisoners."
McAndrew also said that as he prepared to leave Florida State Prison in 1998, he warned incoming warden James Crosby about a "goon squad" at the prison that was so violent toward inmates he feared "it would only be a matter of time before a prisoner would be killed."
But he says his warnings went unheeded, and inmate Frank Valdes was killed by a squad of officers who entered his cell in July 1999 in a highly publicized case that led to the indictment of several guards on second-degree murder charges. Some of the guards were acquitted at trial and prosecutors dropped charges against the rest.
Since then, Crosby has become DOC secretary.
"Ron McAndrew has been using every avenue available for the last six years to discredit the reputation of Secretary Crosby, and his baseless allegations do not dignify a response from this agency or from the secretary himself," said DOC spokesman Sterling Ivey.
McAndrew, who is 66 and retired from the prison system, was one of several witnesses who testified Tuesday before the committee, which has much wider scope than Florida's prisons. The 21 commissioners say they are on a mission to study and prevent abuses in the nation's prisons.
Even as they noted the professionalism of most in the corrections business, they said abuses in prisons and jails keep recurring. "We don't know why well-meaning officials sometimes do awful things," Katzenbach said.
On Tuesday, the commissioners heard some examples. Among them:
Garrett Cunningham told commissioners he was raped by a guard in a Texas prison and that when he later complained, authorities brushed his complaints aside. The officer later was charged in an alleged assault on another inmate, and agreed to a plea deal that will keep him out of prison. Cunningham, 33, was released from prison about a year ago. He has begun a prisoner support organization.
Jeffrey Scott Hornoff, a former Rhode Island police detective, was convicted of murder and spent six years in prison, but was later cleared after another man confessed to the crime. He said he endured constant humiliation from guards - he refuses to use the term "correctional officers." He said he frequently heard inmates being beaten by guards in solitary confinement. Hornoff, 42, is trying to be reinstated at the police department where he once worked and carries a business card that lists his professional history: "Detective, convicted murderer, exoneree, speaker & advocate."
Judith Haney told commissioners that after she was arrested during the 2003 free trade agreement protests in Miami, she was forced to strip and consent to an invasive search. Female inmates at the time were routinely strip-searched in Miami-Dade, in spite of state law that says such searches can be done only in certain cases, and despite that male inmates arrested on similar charges were not. Haney, 51, of Oakland, Calif., was among those filing a class-action lawsuit over the searches. Miami-Dade County settled the case this week for $4.5-million and a promise to end the practice.
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6/29/2009 4:22:34 AM From: MrsK I'm sorry that is not the Full Story - it's the story in which I found the story. I am going to go and google this guys name. Six years he was in there... I wonder what law he broke.
It's sad, very sad. And this guy was s cop for crying out loud. | |
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6/29/2009 5:28:37 AM From: MrsK BTW I am referring to Jeffrey Scott Hornoff. He even printed "Murderer" on his business cards! lol "Hornoff, 42, is trying to be reinstated at the police department where he once worked and carries a business card that lists his professional history: "Detective, convicted murderer, exoneree, speaker & advocate."
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6/29/2009 7:39:45 AM From: ImWithStupid "From: MrsK Really Hugo? Why don't we look up Paris Hilton a few years back, and see if we can't finds a lovely little story about a Jail Warden releasing her before her sentence was up eh? That was just a jail, the warden did not lose his job because he was within his rights to do so."
Wasn't she just placed on in home detention? That was Sheriff Barca who did that. I'm guessing that it's the same there as it is here. The person can serve monitored in home detention, and if so, here it's totally the Sheriff's decision if it's in the jail or monitored in the home. | |
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| 6/29/2009 7:46:39 AM From: MrsK The judge sentenced her to Jail Time - not Home Detention. The warden, within his rights, overrode the judges decision. That is the point being made. | |
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| 6/29/2009 8:41:37 AM From: MrsK Ali - John D. Ferguson the CEO of Corrections Corporation of America has a Forbes proffy. And I bet he's looking for a sexy young wife just like you. He's only 63! Give him a shot! | |
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6/29/2009 8:49:45 AM From: MrsK From: Ali My new goal is to own a prison so I can get harsher laws passed(hopefully targeting minorities!) in order to gain more "customers".
I'm sure I'll be on Forbes Fortune 100 list in no time!
http://people.forbes.com/profile/john-d-ferguson/23393 <<<See! | |
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6/29/2009 10:03:23 AM From: BCAR "Ali - John D. Ferguson the CEO of Corrections Corporation of America has a Forbes proffy. And I bet he's looking for a sexy young wife just like you. He's only 63! Give him a shot!"
Half assed attempt at a low blow.
Actually he should be so lucky. | |
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| 6/29/2009 10:56:22 AM From: whogo And Paris was put back in jail where she belonged. | |
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| 6/29/2009 11:12:32 AM From: whogo It is sad how liberals champion the rights of scumbag prisoners, disproportionately black and hispanic, while persecuting asian college students. Liberal values. | |
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6/29/2009 12:10:47 PM From: Ali "Ali - John D. Ferguson the CEO of Corrections Corporation of America has a Forbes proffy. And I bet he's looking for a sexy young wife just like you. He's only 63! Give him a shot!"
No thanks. A wise man once told me to never settle. I still hold that advice close to my heart.
Besides, I'm a lot of rotten things but I ain't no gold digger. | |
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| 6/29/2009 1:58:08 PM From: MrsK Excuse me? I wasn't knocking Ali, what the hell is the matter with BCAR? | |
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6/29/2009 2:03:44 PM From: MrsK That should read, What the hell is the matter with you BCAR? Look I realize you people haven't reached your yearly drama quota, but I ain't gonna be your fukin sacrifice.
Ali, I wasn't knocking you at all, you mentioned something about being in the Forbes list and it made me wonder so I went and looked it up. That's all. Take it how you want to, but I just needed to clarify.
BCAR just because you got caught snoozing, tried to call me out and stuck your foot in your mouth doesn't mean you have to go and start shit between myself and someone else. | |
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| 6/29/2009 2:21:10 PM From: MrsK The only Asian cllege student I know anything about Hugo was Xing who was in my class last year for Ed Tech. I helped her get an A for the term. I don't know what persecution you are talking about. *shrugs* | |
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6/29/2009 2:21:26 PM From: BCAR ZZBZZZZlZZZZZOZZZZZWZZZZMZZZZEZZZZZ
(snoozing) | |
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6/29/2009 3:02:46 PM From: eddo "Look I realize you people haven't reached your yearly drama quota, but I ain't gonna be your fukin sacrifice."
since when???? We gotta get a new drama sacrifice this year??? Shouldn't someone have said something about this, oh I dunno... maybe in ...
THE BEGINNING OF THE FREAKIN YEAR????
MrsK- after 6 or so straight years, you can't just up and quit like that. It is quite uncouth.
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| 6/29/2009 3:04:43 PM From: MrsK Your last victim was TJ (Not that I am ungrateful). I quit long before that. You are just now realizing that? | |
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6/29/2009 3:09:36 PM From: BCAR I really wish we could get this post back on topic. Which was something about privatization of correctional institutions and how that is somehow a bad thing.
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| 6/29/2009 3:11:22 PM From: MrsK Do you have anything to add? | |
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| 6/29/2009 3:14:25 PM From: BCAR No it's way over my head as you already pointed out in comment #5. | |
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| 6/29/2009 3:17:20 PM From: MrsK BCAR - for one you hadn't even replied yet. For two seriously, get over your funk and then talk to me. Your being childish. | |
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| 6/29/2009 3:17:51 PM From: MrsK 're | |
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6/29/2009 4:36:15 PM From: eddo yeah, BCAR, I'm the one with the empty little head.
dumbass... | |
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6/29/2009 4:42:32 PM From: eddo which i would point out- was the first personal attack in this post.
but I digress... | |
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| 6/29/2009 4:44:05 PM From: Feckless Wench Oh for goodness sake! |  |
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6/29/2009 6:06:06 PM From: Ali In BCAR's defense, it could have been construed as a slam.
He was just defending my honor cuz he's a sweetheart like that.
I'm cool with it so let's get back to business.  | |
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| 6/29/2009 6:07:29 PM From: Ali We were discussing the fact that eddo is a peabrain, right? | |
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| 6/29/2009 6:17:59 PM From: whogo The smart students ain't in community colleges. | |
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| 6/29/2009 6:18:55 PM From: whogo Is that Tanya Harding on crack? | |
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