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Animals Gone WildAuthor:Chi Viewed:  216  
Iranian cleric says "rioters" should be executed   
 TEHRAN (Reuters) – A hardline Iranian cleric on Friday called for the execution of "rioters," in a sign of the authorities' determination to stamp out opposition to the June 12 presidential election result.

(EDITORS' NOTE: Reuters and other foreign media are subject to Iranian restrictions on their ability to report, film or take pictures in Tehran.)

Iran's top legislative body, the Guardian Council, said it had found no major violations in the election, which it called the "healthiest" vote since the 1979 Islamic Revolution.

The council had already rejected a call for the annulment of the vote by moderate former Prime Minister Mirhossein Mousavi, who has led mass protests since he was declared a distant second in the election behind incumbent President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad.

"I want the judiciary to ... punish leading rioters firmly and without showing any mercy to teach everyone a lesson," Ahmad Khatami told worshippers at Tehran University.

Iranian state television said on Thursday eight Basij militiamen were killed by "rioters" during the protests. State media previously said 20 people were killed in the marches.

The Group of Eight foreign ministers, meeting in Italy, said they "deplored" the post-election violence and called on Iran to settle the crisis soon through democratic dialogue and peaceful means.

"The crisis should be settled soon through democratic dialogue and peaceful means on the basis of the rule of law," said a final draft statement by the G8 ministers. "We call on the Iranian government to guarantee that the will of the Iranian people is reflected in the electoral process."

Iranian authorities have accused Mousavi of being responsible for the bloodshed, while the moderate former prime minister says the government is to blame.

Khatami, a member of the Assembly of Experts, said the judiciary should charge the leading "rioters" as being "mohareb" or one who wages war against God.

"They should be punished ruthlessly and savagely," he said. Under Iran's Islamic law, punishment for people convicted as mohareb is execution.

Mousavi's supporters plan to release thousands of balloons on Friday with the message: "Neda you will always remain in our hearts," in memory of Neda Agha Soltan, the young woman killed last week who has become an icon of the demonstrations.

Khatami said Neda was killed by the rioters themselves for propaganda purposes. "By watching the film, any wise person can understand that rioters killed her," he said.

Britain's Times newspaper quoted Dr. Arash Hejazi, an Iranian who appeared on Internet videos helping Neda, as echoing opposition charges the 26-year-old music student was killed by a government militiaman.

"She was just a person in the street who was against the injustice going on in her country, and for that she was murdered," he said. Hejazi said that after the protest he left Iran for Britain, where he is resident, fearing arrest.

The authorities have used a combination of warnings, arrests and the threat of police action to drive large demonstrations off Tehran's street since Saturday with small gatherings dispersed with tear gas and baton charges.

Russia, which along with China congratulated Ahmadinejad on his re-election earlier this month, said on Friday it was seriously concerned by the use of force in Iran.

"We naturally express our most serious concern about the use of force and the death of civilians," Russian Foreign Minister Sergei Lavrov was quoted as saying on the sidelines of the G8 meeting.

Russia was among countries at the G8 anxious not to slam the door on possible talks with Iran, the world's fifth largest oil exporter, over its nuclear program.

"I think there is unity here that it is for the Iranian people to choose their government but it is for the Iranian government to protect their people," British Foreign Secretary David Miliband said after the foreign ministers' meeting.

The 12-man Guardian Council's statement leaves little scope for more legal challenges to the election result, short of an attack on the position of Supreme Leader Ayatollah Ali Khamenei, who has expressed strong support for Ahmadinejad.

"The Guardian Council has almost finished reviewing defeated candidates' election complaints...the reviews showed that the election was the healthiest since the revolution ... There were no major violations in the election," said Abbasali Kadkhodai, spokesman of the council.

Former President Akbar Hashemi Rafsanjani, a Mousavi ally, chairs the Assembly of Experts which has the constitutional power to depose Khamenei. The assembly has never tried to do so and Rasfanjani is seen as unlikely to take such a radical step.

Mousavi said he was determined to keep challenging the election results despite pressure to stop. He called on his supporters to continue "legal" protests and said restrictions on the opposition could lead to more violence.

Replies
6/26/2009 8:26:20 AM   From:  BCAR   "They should be punished ruthlessly and savagely," he said. Under Iran's Islamic law, punishment for people convicted as mohareb is execution.

I'm sure Mohamed approves, peace be upon him.
6/26/2009 8:26:28 AM   From:  Chi   Death? Savagely and ruthlessly? And just how is this waging war against God??? Are corrupt dictators god now? And yes, everyone can see that the protesters killed one of their own merely for propaganda...

This is a time to thank our lucky stars of the freedoms and rights we have in this country.
6/26/2009 8:30:15 AM   From:  BCAR   I've never believed that any religion should be outlawed. But one that encourages murder, torture and slavery really has no place in civilized society.
6/26/2009 8:49:38 AM   From:  Chi   While I don't agree with or like the Muslim religion, not all who follow the religion are like that. In that case Christianity should have been outlawed, too. How many people were killed and tortured to convert to so-called Christianity or for simply being accused of not being for it? Man has always committed evil and murder under the pretense of this, that or the other.
6/26/2009 9:05:39 AM   From:  BCAR   The difference Chi. is that 1,500 years ago when people thought the world was flat Christians did indeed commit wars of conquest and atrocities on people. So did the Muslims of the time.

Somehow, since the discovery of the new world, and the invention of electricity etc. mankind has progressed and Christianity progressed along with it (of course some will point to Eric Rudolf and 3 or 4 other nut cases who happen to be Christians). But the fact is that much of Islam has decided to stay in the dark ages.
6/26/2009 9:16:30 AM   From:  Chi   Those are some good points that I can't argue with. The Muslims who have progressed in their thinking have done more so by other means in their life - such as education & career. Sadly the Clerics and others in power have not progressed in their thinking, conveniently so to supress their followers and get them to do what they want in the guise of religion and "god's will."
6/26/2009 9:26:10 AM   From:  BCAR   The game in many of the Muslim Theocracies has been to keep the population under educated, poor and ignorant. The better to control them. Iran on the other hand had been a very progressive country prior to the Fundementalist takeover in the late 70,s. But the educational system persisted, now in just one generation the people are ready to take their country back.
6/26/2009 9:39:57 AM   From:  Chi   Well I hope that they succeed in that, and without our help. We have enough problems of our own right now.
6/26/2009 11:12:18 AM   From:  ImWithStupid   "From: BCAR The game in many of the Muslim Theocracies has been to keep the population under educated, poor and ignorant. The better to control them."


So what you're saying, BCAR, is that they are like Democrats.
6/26/2009 11:26:03 AM   From:  whogo   www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/middleeast... The religion of peace. 
6/26/2009 8:29:26 PM   From:  MrsK   Islam the religion does not promote murder. Any moron who states such seriously needs to grow the fuk up already.
6/26/2009 8:30:31 PM   From:  MrsK   "I've never believed that any religion should be outlawed. But one that encourages murder, torture and slavery really has no place in civilized society." Oh Goody! Time to start twisting the interpretations of bible again! WAHOO!!!
6/26/2009 8:35:52 PM   From:  MrsK   The fact that slavery exists in the Bible is no secret. There are laws regulating its practice; how to buy and sell slaves, what to do if they commit a crime, the degree to which they can be beat, and laws concerning sexual activity with female slaves. Some of these verses are included here. The point here is not to comment on the existence of slavery or the Bible's laws regarding it. My intention is more to increase awareness of its presence in Biblical text. A slave in the Bible (or in Greek, Roman, Islamic, or Egyptian history for that matter) is not the same as a slave in the Trans Atlantic Slave Trade. This new form of plantation slavery was unique in history in that it was based solely on race.

Regarding the emancipation of slaves, Jewish slaves were to be freed after six years, except those who were born by the female slave. Female slaves, sold into slavery by their fathers, would be slaves forever. And the cost of freeing a slave was calculated using the number of years to the next Jubilee Year, ranging between 1 and 50 years.

Exodus 21:1-4 "If thou buy an Hebrew servant, six years he shall serve: and in the seventh he shall go out free for nothing. If he came in by himself, he shall go out by himself: if he were married, then his wife shall go out with him. If his master have given him a wife, and she have born him sons or daughters; the wife and her children shall be her master's, and he shall go out by himself."
Deuteronomy 15:12-18 "And if thy brother, an Hebrew man, or an Hebrew woman, be sold unto thee, and serve thee six years; then in the seventh year thou shalt let him go free from thee.And when thou sendest him out free from thee, thou shalt not let him go away empty: Thou shalt furnish him liberally out of thy flock, and out of thy floor, and out of thy winepress: of that wherewith the Lord thy God hath blessed thee thou shalt give unto him."
Exodus 21 "And if a man sell his daughter to be a maidservant, she shall not go out as the menservants do."
Regarding the beating and killing of slaves, the Book of Exodus contains laws regarding punishment for the one who kills the slave as well as injunctions to avoid injuring the eyes and teeth.

Exodus 210-21 "And if a man smite his servant, or his maid, with a rod, and he die under his hand; he shall be surely punished. Notwithstanding, if he continue a day or two, he shall not be punished: for he is his money."
Exodus 216-27 "And if a man smite the eye of his servant, or the eye of his maid, that it perish; he shall let him go free for his eye's sake. And if he smite out his manservant's tooth, or his maidservant's tooth; he shall let him go free for his tooth's sake."
The Book of Leviticus prohibited the harsh ruling over other Israelites, but that slaves could be taken from the Gentiles.

Leviticus 25:44-46 "Both thy bondmen, and thy bondmaids, which thou shalt have, shall be of the heathen that are round about you; of them shall ye buy bondmen and bondmaids. Moreover of the children of the strangers that do sojourn among you, of them shall ye buy, and of their families that are with you, which they begat in your land: and they shall be your possession. And ye shall take them as an inheritance for your children after you, to inherit them for a possession; they shall be your bondmen for ever: but over your brethren the children of Israel, ye shall not rule one over another with rigour."
Also, in Leviticus, a distinction is made between the hired servant and the slave.

Leviticus 25:48-53 "After that he is sold he may be redeemed again; one of his brethren may redeem him: Either his uncle, or his uncle's son, may redeem him, or any that is nigh of kin unto him of his family may redeem him; or if he be able, he may redeem himself. And he shall reckon with him that bought him from the year that he was sold to him unto the year of jubilee: and the price of his sale shall be according unto the number of years, according to the time of an hired servant shall it be with him."
Slaves were to undergo circumcision.

Genesis 17:13 "He that is born in thy house, and he that is bought with thy money, must needs be circumcised: and my covenant shall be in your flesh for an everlasting covenant."
Genesis 177 "And all the men of his house, born in the house, and bought with money of the stranger, were circumcised with him."
Female captives are considered spoils of war.

Deuteronomy 21:10-14 "When thou goest forth to war against thine enemies, and the Lord thy God hath delivered them into thine hands, and thou hast taken them captive, And seest among the captives a beautiful woman, and hast a desire unto her, that thou wouldest have her to thy wife; Then thou shalt bring her home to thine house; and she shall shave her head, and pare her nails; And she shall put the raiment of her captivity from off her, and shall remain in thine house, and bewail her father and her mother a full month: and after that thou shalt go in unto her, and be her husband, and she shall be thy wife. And it shall be, if thou have no delight in her, then thou shalt let her go whither she will; but thou shalt not sell her at all for money, thou shalt not make merchandise of her, because thou hast humbled her."
Deuteronomy 20:14 "But the women, and the little ones, and the cattle, and all that is in the city, even all the spoil thereof, shalt thou take unto thyself"
The punishment for sexual activity with a female slave who is engaged consisted of animal sacrifice in the Temple.
6/26/2009 8:38:40 PM   From:  MrsK   Murder in the Bible



The act of murder is rampant in the Bible. In much of the Bible, especially the Old Testament, there are laws that command that people be killed for absurd reasons such as working on the Sabbath, being gay, cursing your parents, or not being a virgin on your wedding night. In addition to these crazy and immoral laws, there are plenty of examples of God's irrationality by his direct killing of many people for reasons that defy any rational explanation such as killing children who make fun of bald people, and the killing of a man who tried to keep the ark of God from falling during transport. There are also countless examples of mass murders commanded by God, including the murder of women, infants, and children.



The following passages are a very small percentage of the total passages approving of murder in the Bible. They are divided here into three parts: 1) Capital Punishment Crimes, 2) God's Murders for Stupid Reasons, 3) Murdering Children, and 4) Miscellaneous Murders. This list is long, but it barely scratches the surface of all the murders approved of in the Bible.


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1) Capital Punishment Crimes:



Kill People Who Don't Listen to Priests

Anyone arrogant enough to reject the verdict of the judge or of the priest who represents the LORD your God must be put to death. Such evil must be purged from Israel. (Deuteronomy 17:12 NLT)



Kill Witches

You should not let a sorceress live. (Exodus 22:17 NAB)



Kill Homosexuals
"If a man lies with a male as with a women, both of them shall be put to death for their abominable deed; they have forfeited their lives." (Leviticus 20:13 NAB)



Kill Fortunetellers

A man or a woman who acts as a medium or fortuneteller shall be put to death by stoning; they have no one but themselves to blame for their death. (Leviticus 207 NAB)



Death for Hitting Dad

Whoever strikes his father or mother shall be put to death. (Exodus 21:15 NAB)



Death for Cursing Parents

1) If one curses his father or mother, his lamp will go out at the coming of darkness. (Proverbs 200 NAB)

2) All who curse their father or mother must be put to death. They are guilty of a capital offense. (Leviticus 20 NLT)



Death for Adultery

If a man commits adultery with another man's wife, both the man and the woman must be put to death. (Leviticus 20:10 NLT)



Death for Fornication

A priest's daughter who loses her honor by committing fornication and thereby dishonors her father also, shall be burned to death. (Leviticus 21 NAB)



Death to Followers of Other Religions

Whoever sacrifices to any god, except the Lord alone, shall be doomed. (Exodus 22:19 NAB)



Kill Nonbelievers

They entered into a covenant to seek the Lord, the God of their fathers, with all their heart and soul; and everyone who would not seek the Lord, the God of Israel, was to be put to death, whether small or great, whether man or woman. (2 Chronicles 15:12-13 NAB)



Kill False Prophets

If a man still prophesies, his parents, father and mother, shall say to him, "You shall not live, because you have spoken a lie in the name of the Lord." When he prophesies, his parents, father and mother, shall thrust him through. (Zechariah 13:3 NAB)



Kill the Entire Town if One Person Worships Another God

Suppose you hear in one of the towns the LORD your God is giving you that some worthless rabble among you have led their fellow citizens astray by encouraging them to worship foreign gods. In such cases, you must examine the facts carefully. If you find it is true and can prove that such a detestable act has occurred among you, you must attack that town and completely destroy all its inhabitants, as well as all the livestock. Then you must pile all the plunder in the middle of the street and burn it. Put the entire town to the torch as a burnt offering to the LORD your God. That town must remain a ruin forever; it may never be rebuilt. Keep none of the plunder that has been set apart for destruction. Then the LORD will turn from his fierce anger and be merciful to you. He will have compassion on you and make you a great nation, just as he solemnly promised your ancestors. "The LORD your God will be merciful only if you obey him and keep all the commands I am giving you today, doing what is pleasing to him." (Deuteronomy 13:13-19 NLT)



Kill Women Who Are Not Virgins On Their Wedding Night

But if this charge is true (that she wasn't a virgin on her wedding night), and evidence of the girls virginity is not found, they shall bring the girl to the entrance of her fathers house and there her townsman shall stone her to death, because she committed a crime against Israel by her unchasteness in her father's house. Thus shall you purge the evil from your midst. (Deuteronomy 220-21 NAB)



Kill Followers of Other Religions.

1) If your own full brother, or your son or daughter, or your beloved wife, or you intimate friend, entices you secretly to serve other gods, whom you and your fathers have not known, gods of any other nations, near at hand or far away, from one end of the earth to the other: do not yield to him or listen to him, nor look with pity upon him, to spare or shield him, but kill him. Your hand shall be the first raised to slay him; the rest of the people shall join in with you. You shall stone him to death, because he sought to lead you astray from the Lord, your God, who brought you out of the land of Egypt, that place of slavery. And all Israel, hearing of this, shall fear and never do such evil as this in your midst. (Deuteronomy 13-12 NAB)



2) Suppose a man or woman among you, in one of your towns that the LORD your God is giving you, has done evil in the sight of the LORD your God and has violated the covenant by serving other gods or by worshiping the sun, the moon, or any of the forces of heaven, which I have strictly forbidden. When you hear about it, investigate the matter thoroughly. If it is true that this detestable thing has been done in Israel, then that man or woman must be taken to the gates of the town and stoned to death. (Deuteronomy 17-5 NLT)



Death for Blasphemy

One day a man who had an Israelite mother and an Egyptian father got into a fight with one of the Israelite men. During the fight, this son of an Israelite woman blasphemed the LORD's name. So the man was brought to Moses for judgment. His mother's name was Shelomith. She was the daughter of Dibri of the tribe of Dan. They put the man in custody until the LORD's will in the matter should become clear. Then the LORD said to Moses, "Take the blasphemer outside the camp, and tell all those who heard him to lay their hands on his head. Then let the entire community stone him to death. Say to the people of Israel: Those who blaspheme God will suffer the consequences of their guilt and be punished. Anyone who blasphemes the LORD's name must be stoned to death by the whole community of Israel. Any Israelite or foreigner among you who blasphemes the LORD's name will surely die. (Leviticus 24:10-16 NLT)



Kill False Prophets

1) Suppose there are prophets among you, or those who have dreams about the future, and they promise you signs or miracles, and the predicted signs or miracles take place. If the prophets then say, 'Come, let us worship the gods of foreign nations,' do not listen to them. The LORD your God is testing you to see if you love him with all your heart and soul. Serve only the LORD your God and fear him alone. Obey his commands, listen to his voice, and cling to him. The false prophets or dreamers who try to lead you astray must be put to death, for they encourage rebellion against the LORD your God, who brought you out of slavery in the land of Egypt. Since they try to keep you from following the LORD your God, you must execute them to remove the evil from among you. (Deuteronomy 13:1-5 NLT)



2) But any prophet who claims to give a message from another god or who falsely claims to speak for me must die.' You may wonder, 'How will we know whether the prophecy is from the LORD or not?' If the prophet predicts something in the LORD's name and it does not happen, the LORD did not give the message. That prophet has spoken on his own and need not be feared. (Deuteronomy 180-22 NLT)



Infidels and Gays Should Die

So God let them go ahead and do whatever shameful things their hearts desired. As a result, they did vile and degrading things with each other's bodies. Instead of believing what they knew was the truth about God, they deliberately chose to believe lies. So they worshiped the things God made but not the Creator himself, who is to be praised forever. Amen. That is why God abandoned them to their shameful desires. Even the women turned against the natural way to have sex and instead indulged in sex with each other. And the men, instead of having normal sexual relationships with women, burned with lust for each other. Men did shameful things with other men and, as a result, suffered within themselves the penalty they so richly deserved. When they refused to acknowledge God, he abandoned them to their evil minds and let them do things that should never be done. Their lives became full of every kind of wickedness, sin, greed, hate, envy, murder, fighting, deception, malicious behavior, and gossip. They are backstabbers, haters of God, insolent, proud, and boastful. They are forever inventing new ways of sinning and are disobedient to their parents. They refuse to understand, break their promises, and are heartless and unforgiving. They are fully aware of God's death penalty for those who do these things, yet they go right ahead and do them anyway. And, worse yet, they encourage others to do them, too. (Romans 14-32 NLT)



Kill Anyone who Approaches the Tabernacle

For the LORD had said to Moses, 'Exempt the tribe of Levi from the census; do not include them when you count the rest of the Israelites. You must put the Levites in charge of the Tabernacle of the Covenant, along with its furnishings and equipment. They must carry the Tabernacle and its equipment as you travel, and they must care for it and camp around it. Whenever the Tabernacle is moved, the Levites will take it down and set it up again. Anyone else who goes too near the Tabernacle will be executed.' (Numbers 1:48-51 NLT)



Kill People for Working on the Sabbath

The LORD then gave these further instructions to Moses: 'Tell the people of Israel to keep my Sabbath day, for the Sabbath is a sign of the covenant between me and you forever. It helps you to remember that I am the LORD, who makes you holy. Yes, keep the Sabbath day, for it is holy. Anyone who desecrates it must die; anyone who works on that day will be cut off from the community. Work six days only, but the seventh day must be a day of total rest. I repeat: Because the LORD considers it a holy day, anyone who works on the Sabbath must be put to death.' (Exodus 31:12-15 NLT)




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2) God's Murders for Stupid Reasons:



Kill Brats

From there Elisha went up to Bethel. While he was on his way, some small boys came out of the city and jeered at him. "Go up baldhead," they shouted, "go up baldhead!" The prophet turned and saw them, and he cursed them in the name of the Lord. Then two shebears came out of the woods and tore forty two of the children to pieces. (2 Kings 23-24 NAB)



God Kills the Curious

And he smote of the men of Beth-shemesh, because they had looked into the ark of Jehovah, he smote of the people seventy men, `and' fifty thousand men; and the people mourned, because Jehovah had smitten the people with a great slaughter. And the men of Beth-shemesh said, Who is able to stand before Jehovah, this holy God? and to whom shall he go up from us? (1Samuel 6:19-20 ASV)



Killed by a Lion

Meanwhile, the LORD instructed one of the group of prophets to say to another man, "Strike me!" But the man refused to strike the prophet. Then the prophet told him, "Because you have not obeyed the voice of the LORD, a lion will kill you as soon as you leave me." And sure enough, when he had gone, a lion attacked and killed him. (1 Kings 20:35-36 NLT)



Killing the Good Samaritan

The ark of God was placed on a new cart and taken away from the house of Abinadab on the hill. Uzzah and Ahio, sons of Abinadab guided the cart, with Ahio walking before it, while David and all the Israelites made merry before the Lord with all their strength, with singing and with citharas, harps, tambourines, sistrums, and cymbals.

When they came to the threshing floor of Nodan, Uzzah reached out his hand to the ark of God to steady it, for the oxen were making it tip. But the Lord was angry with Uzzah; God struck him on that spot, and he died there before God. (2 Samuel 6:3-7 NAB)




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3) Murdering Children



Kill Sons of Sinners

Make ready to slaughter his sons for the guilt of their fathers; Lest they rise and posses the earth, and fill the breadth of the world with tyrants. (Isaiah 141 NAB)



God Will Kill Children

The glory of Israel will fly away like a bird, for your children will die at birth or perish in the womb or never even be conceived. Even if your children do survive to grow up, I will take them from you. It will be a terrible day when I turn away and leave you alone. I have watched Israel become as beautiful and pleasant as Tyre. But now Israel will bring out her children to be slaughtered." O LORD, what should I request for your people? I will ask for wombs that don't give birth and breasts that give no milk. The LORD says, "All their wickedness began at Gilgal; there I began to hate them. I will drive them from my land because of their evil actions. I will love them no more because all their leaders are rebels. The people of Israel are stricken. Their roots are dried up; they will bear no more fruit. And if they give birth, I will slaughter their beloved children." (Hosea 9:11-16 NLT)



Kill Men, Women, and Children

"Then I heard the LORD say to the other men, "Follow him through the city and kill everyone whose forehead is not marked. Show no mercy; have no pity! Kill them all – old and young, girls and women and little children. But do not touch anyone with the mark. Begin your task right here at the Temple." So they began by killing the seventy leaders. "Defile the Temple!" the LORD commanded. "Fill its courtyards with the bodies of those you kill! Go!" So they went throughout the city and did as they were told." (Ezekiel 9:5-7 NLT)



God Kills all the First Born of Egypt

And at midnight the LORD killed all the firstborn sons in the land of Egypt, from the firstborn son of Pharaoh, who sat on the throne, to the firstborn son of the captive in the dungeon. Even the firstborn of their livestock were killed. Pharaoh and his officials and all the people of Egypt woke up during the night, and loud wailing was heard throughout the land of Egypt. There was not a single house where someone had not died. (Exodus 129-30 NLT)



Kill Old Men and Young Women

"You are my battle-ax and sword," says the LORD. "With you I will shatter nations and destroy many kingdoms. With you I will shatter armies, destroying the horse and rider, the chariot and charioteer. With you I will shatter men and women, old people and children, young men and maidens. With you I will shatter shepherds and flocks, farmers and oxen, captains and rulers. "As you watch, I will repay Babylon and the people of Babylonia for all the wrong they have done to my people in Jerusalem," says the LORD. "Look, O mighty mountain, destroyer of the earth! I am your enemy," says the LORD. "I will raise my fist against you, to roll you down from the heights. When I am finished, you will be nothing but a heap of rubble. You will be desolate forever. Even your stones will never again be used for building. You will be completely wiped out," says the LORD. (Jeremiah 510-26)

(Note that after God promises the Israelites a victory against Babylon, the Israelites actually get their butts kicked by them in the next chapter. So much for an all-knowing and all-powerful God.)



God Will Kill the Children of Sinners

If even then you remain hostile toward me and refuse to obey, I will inflict you with seven more disasters for your sins. I will release wild animals that will kill your children and destroy your cattle, so your numbers will dwindle and your roads will be deserted. (Leviticus 261-22 NLT)



More Rape and Baby Killing

Anyone who is captured will be run through with a sword. Their little children will be dashed to death right before their eyes. Their homes will be sacked and their wives raped by the attacking hordes. For I will stir up the Medes against Babylon, and no amount of silver or gold will buy them off. The attacking armies will shoot down the young people with arrows. They will have no mercy on helpless babies and will show no compassion for the children. (Isaiah 13:15-18 NLT)




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4) Miscellaneous Murders



More of Samson's Murders

(The Lord saves Sampson from standing trial for 30 murders and arson by allowing him to kill 1000 more men.) When he reached Lehi, and the Philistines came shouting to meet him, the spirit of the Lord came upon him: the ropes around his arms become as flax that is consumed by fire and the bonds melted away from his hands. Near him was the fresh jawbone of an ass; he reached out, grasped it, and with it killed a thousand men. (Judges 15:14-15 NAB)



Peter Kills Two People

There was also a man named Ananias who, with his wife, Sapphira, sold some property. He brought part of the money to the apostles, but he claimed it was the full amount. His wife had agreed to this deception. Then Peter said, "Ananias, why has Satan filled your heart? You lied to the Holy Spirit, and you kept some of the money for yourself. The property was yours to sell or not sell, as you wished. And after selling it, the money was yours to give away. How could you do a thing like this? You weren't lying to us but to God." As soon as Ananias heard these words, he fell to the floor and died. Everyone who heard about it was terrified. Then some young men wrapped him in a sheet and took him out and buried him. About three hours later his wife came in, not knowing what had happened. Peter asked her, "Was this the price you and your husband received for your land?" "Yes," she replied, "that was the price." And Peter said, "How could the two of you even think of doing a thing like this – conspiring together to test the Spirit of the Lord? Just outside that door are the young men who buried your husband, and they will carry you out, too." Instantly, she fell to the floor and died. When the young men came in and saw that she was dead, they carried her out and buried her beside her husband. Great fear gripped the entire church and all others who heard what had happened. (Acts 5:1-11 NLT)



Mass Murder

This is what the Lord of hosts has to say: 'I will punish what Amalek did to Israel when he barred his way as he was coming up from Egypt. Go, now, attack Amalek, and deal with him and all that he has under the ban. Do not spare him, but kill men and women, children and infants, oxen and sheep, camels and asses.' (1 Samuel 15-3 NAB)



You Have to Kill

Cursed be he who does the Lords work remissly, cursed he who holds back his sword from blood. (Jeremiah 48:10 NAB)



The Danites Kill the Next Town

But the territory of the Danites was too small for them; so the Danites marched up and attacked Leshem, which they captured and put to the sword. Once they had taken possession of Lesham, they renamed the settlement after their ancestor Dan. (Joshua 19:47 NAB)



God Kills Some More

Then the LORD said to me, "Even if Moses and Samuel stood before me pleading for these people, I wouldn't help them. Away with them! Get them out of my sight! And if they say to you, 'But where can we go?' tell them, 'This is what the LORD says: Those who are destined for death, to death; those who are destined for war, to war; those who are destined for famine, to famine; those who are destined for captivity, to captivity.' "I will send four kinds of destroyers against them," says the LORD. "I will send the sword to kill, the dogs to drag away, the vultures to devour, and the wild animals to finish up what is left. Because of the wicked things Manasseh son of Hezekiah, king of Judah, did in Jerusalem, I will make my people an object of horror to all the kingdoms of the earth." (Jeremiah 15:1-4 NLT)



God Promises More Killing

I will make Mount Seir utterly desolate, killing off all who try to escape and any who return. I will fill your mountains with the dead. Your hills, your valleys, and your streams will be filled with people slaughtered by the sword. I will make you desolate forever. Your cities will never be rebuilt. Then you will know that I am the LORD. (Ezekiel 35-9 NLT)



The Angel of Death

My angel will go before you and bring you to the Amorites, Hittites, Perizzites, Canaanites, Hivites, and Jebusites; and I will wipe them out. (Exodus 233 NAB)



Destruction of Ai

Then the LORD said to Joshua, "Do not be afraid or discouraged. Take the entire army and attack Ai, for I have given to you the king of Ai, his people, his city, and his land. You will destroy them as you destroyed Jericho and its king. But this time you may keep the captured goods and the cattle for yourselves. Set an ambush behind the city." So Joshua and the army of Israel set out to attack Ai. Joshua chose thirty thousand fighting men and sent them out at night with these orders: "Hide in ambush close behind the city and be ready for action. When our main army attacks, the men of Ai will come out to fight as they did before, and we will run away from them. We will let them chase us until they have all left the city. For they will say, 'The Israelites are running away from us as they did before.' Then you will jump up from your ambush and take possession of the city, for the LORD your God will give it to you. Set the city on fire, as the LORD has commanded. You have your orders." So they left that night and lay in ambush between Bethel and the west side of Ai. But Joshua remained among the people in the camp that night.

Early the next morning Joshua roused his men and started toward Ai, accompanied by the leaders of Israel. They camped on the north side of Ai, with a valley between them and the city. That night Joshua sent five thousand men to lie in ambush between Bethel and Ai, on the west side of the city. So they stationed the main army north of the city and the ambush west of the city. Joshua himself spent that night in the valley. When the king of Ai saw the Israelites across the valley, he and all his army hurriedly went out early the next morning and attacked the Israelites at a place overlooking the Jordan Valley. But he didn't realize there was an ambush behind the city. Joshua and the Israelite army fled toward the wilderness as though they were badly beaten, and all the men in the city were called out to chase after them. In this way, they were lured away from the city. There was not a man left in Ai or Bethel who did not chase after the Israelites, and the city was left wide open.

Then the LORD said to Joshua, "Point your spear toward Ai, for I will give you the city." Joshua did as he was commanded. As soon as Joshua gave the signal, the men in ambush jumped up and poured into the city. They quickly captured it and set it on fire. When the men of Ai looked behind them, smoke from the city was filling the sky, and they had nowhere to go. For the Israelites who had fled in the direction of the wilderness now turned on their pursuers. When Joshua and the other Israelites saw that the ambush had succeeded and that smoke was rising from the city, they turned and attacked the men of Ai. Then the Israelites who were inside the city came out and started killing the enemy from the rear. So the men of Ai were caught in a trap, and all of them died. Not a single person survived or escaped. Only the king of Ai was taken alive and brought to Joshua.

When the Israelite army finished killing all the men outside the city, they went back and finished off everyone inside. So the entire population of Ai was wiped out that day – twelve thousand in all. For Joshua kept holding out his spear until everyone who had lived in Ai was completely destroyed. Only the cattle and the treasures of the city were not destroyed, for the Israelites kept these for themselves, as the LORD had commanded Joshua. So Ai became a permanent mound of ruins, desolate to this very day. Joshua hung the king of Ai on a tree and left him there until evening. At sunset the Israelites took down the body and threw it in front of the city gate. They piled a great heap of stones over him that can still be seen today. (Joshua 8:1-29 NLT)



Killing at Jericho

When the people heard the sound of the horns, they shouted as loud as they could. Suddenly, the walls of Jericho collapsed, and the Israelites charged straight into the city from every side and captured it. They completely destroyed everything in it – men and women, young and old, cattle, sheep, donkeys – everything. (Joshua 60-21 NLT)



God Kills an Extended Family

"You have done more evil than all who lived before you. You have made other gods and have made me furious with your gold calves. And since you have turned your back on me, I will bring disaster on your dynasty and kill all your sons, slave or free alike. I will burn up your royal dynasty as one burns up trash until it is all gone. I, the LORD, vow that the members of your family who die in the city will be eaten by dogs, and those who die in the field will be eaten by vultures.'" Then Ahijah said to Jeroboam's wife, "Go on home, and when you enter the city, the child will die. All Israel will mourn for him and bury him. He is the only member of your family who will have a proper burial, for this child is the only good thing that the LORD, the God of Israel, sees in the entire family of Jeroboam. And the LORD will raise up a king over Israel who will destroy the family of Jeroboam. This will happen today, even now! Then the LORD will shake Israel like a reed whipped about in a stream. He will uproot the people of Israel from this good land that he gave their ancestors and will scatter them beyond the Euphrates River, for they have angered the LORD by worshiping Asherah poles. He will abandon Israel because Jeroboam sinned and made all of Israel sin along with him." (1 Kings 14-16 NLT)



Mass Murder

The men of Israel withdrew through the territory of the Benjaminites, putting to the sword the inhabitants of the city, the livestock, and all they chanced upon. Moreover they destroyed by fire all the cities they came upon. (Judges 20:48 NAB)



The Angel of Death

That night the angel of the Lord went forth and struck down one hundred and eighty five thousand men in the Assyrian camp. Early the next morning, there they were, all the corpuses of the dead. (2 Kings 19:35 NAB)



Kill Your Neighbors

(Moses) stood at the entrance to the camp and shouted, "All of you who are on the LORD's side, come over here and join me." And all the Levites came. He told them, "This is what the LORD, the God of Israel, says: Strap on your swords! Go back and forth from one end of the camp to the other, killing even your brothers, friends, and neighbors." The Levites obeyed Moses, and about three thousand people died that day. Then Moses told the Levites, "Today you have been ordained for the service of the LORD, for you obeyed him even though it meant killing your own sons and brothers. Because of this, he will now give you a great blessing." (Exodus 326-29 NLT)



Kill the Family of Sinners

And Joshua said to Achan, My son, give, I pray thee, glory to the LORD God of Israel, and make confession to him; and tell me now what thou hast done, hide it not from me. And Achan answered Joshua, and said, Indeed I have sinned against the LORD God of Israel, and thus and thus have I done. When I saw among the spoils a goodly Babylonish garment, and two hundred shekels of silver, and a wedge of gold of fifty shekels weight, then I coveted them, and took them, and behold, they are hid in the earth in the midst of my tent, and the silver under it." [Note that the sin is not looting, but failing to give the loot to the treasury of the Lord.] "So Joshua sent messengers, and they ran to the tent, and behold, it was hid in his tent, and the silver under it. And they took them from the midst of the tent, and brought them to Joshua, and to all the children of Israel, and laid them out before the LORD. And Joshua, and all Israel with him, took Achan the son of Zerah, and the silver, and the garment, and the wedge of gold, and his sons, and his daughters, and his oxen, and his asses, and his sheep, and his tent, and all that he had: and they brought them to the valley of Achor. And Joshua said, why hast thou troubled us? the LORD shall trouble thee this day. And all Israel stoned him with stones, and burned them with fire, after they had stoned them with stones. And they raised over him a great heap of stones to this day. So the LORD turned from the fierceness of his anger: wherefore the name of that place was called the valley of Achor to this day. (Joshua 7:19-26 Webster's Bible)



Kill Followers of Other Religions

While the Israelites were camped at Acacia, some of the men defiled themselves by sleeping with the local Moabite women. These women invited them to attend sacrifices to their gods, and soon the Israelites were feasting with them and worshiping the gods of Moab. Before long Israel was joining in the worship of Baal of Peor, causing the LORD's anger to blaze against his people. The LORD issued the following command to Moses: "Seize all the ringleaders and execute them before the LORD in broad daylight, so his fierce anger will turn away from the people of Israel." So Moses ordered Israel's judges to execute everyone who had joined in worshiping Baal of Peor. Just then one of the Israelite men brought a Midianite woman into the camp, right before the eyes of Moses and all the people, as they were weeping at the entrance of the Tabernacle. When Phinehas son of Eleazar and grandson of Aaron the priest saw this, he jumped up and left the assembly. Then he took a spear and rushed after the man into his tent. Phinehas thrust the spear all the way through the man's body and into the woman's stomach. So the plague against the Israelites was stopped, but not before 24,000 people had died. (Numbers 25:1-9 NLT)



Murder

At the customary time for offering the evening sacrifice, Elijah the prophet walked up to the altar and prayed, "O LORD, God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, prove today that you are God in Israel and that I am your servant. Prove that I have done all this at your command. O LORD, answer me! Answer me so these people will know that you, O LORD, are God and that you have brought them back to yourself." Immediately the fire of the LORD flashed down from heaven and burned up the young bull, the wood, the stones, and the dust. It even licked up all the water in the ditch! And when the people saw it, they fell on their faces and cried out, "The LORD is God! The LORD is God!" Then Elijah commanded, "Seize all the prophets of Baal. Don't let a single one escape!" So the people seized them all, and Elijah took them down to the Kishon Valley and killed them there. (1 Kings 18:36-40 NLT)



Kill All of Babylon

"Go up, my warriors, against the land of Merathaim and against the people of Pekod. Yes, march against Babylon, the land of rebels, a land that I will judge! Pursue, kill, and completely destroy them, as I have commanded you," says the LORD. "Let the battle cry be heard in the land, a shout of great destruction". (Jeremiah 501-22 NLT)



Micah Kills a Whole Town

Then, with Micah's idols and his priest, the men of Dan came to the town of Laish, whose people were peaceful and secure. They attacked and killed all the people and burned the town to the ground. There was no one to rescue the residents of the town, for they lived a great distance from Sidon and had no allies nearby. This happened in the valley near Beth-rehob.Then the people of the tribe of Dan rebuilt the town and lived there. They renamed the town Dan after their ancestor, Israel's son, but it had originally been called Laish. (Judges 187-29 NLT) (Note that God approves of this slaughter in verse 6.)



6/26/2009 8:40:30 PM   From:  MrsK   This is my ppersonal favorite:

Kill Nonbelievers

They entered into a covenant to seek the Lord, the God of their fathers, with all their heart and soul; and everyone who would not seek the Lord, the God of Israel, was to be put to death, whether small or great, whether man or woman. (2 Chronicles 15:12-13 NAB)
6/26/2009 8:41:29 PM   From:  MrsK   Amazing... So while we are at it lets outlaw Christianity and burn every bible ok?
6/26/2009 8:58:31 PM   From:  ImWithStupid   It's obvious that you are nothing but an Anti-Semite. Jew hater.

You're no better than Ahmedinejad or Hitler.
6/26/2009 9:03:33 PM   From:  MrsK   Oh God! Not the HITLER COMPARISON! Is that the best you can do?
6/26/2009 9:09:33 PM   From:  MrsK   BTW - if by some idiotic twist of fate that comment you just made was NOT in jest, you're an ignorant fool.

And for the record, my Stepfather the man that I call "Daddy" is Jewish, as was my Grandfather on his side (May he rest in peace) Grandmother, and my sister (his daughter). No IWS, (IRL) I am an extremely accepting person. As I've stated repeatedly I study and learn about as many religions as I possibly can. So knowing what I know about as many religions as I've looked into, I really hate when someone puts out hatred aimed at ANY religion due to the individulas or even the societies grave misunderstanding and lack of desire to investigate further before opening mouth and instering foot. People aren't looking for the truth and integrity behind anything anymore. They just want something to bitch about, and sensationalize so that they have something negative to bitch about.
6/26/2009 9:26:57 PM   From:  ImWithStupid   So why would you support those whose life mission it is to wipe the earth of all Jews.

Tell yourself what you want. Your support of the Mullahs in Iran is to support the murder of your "dad".

I know that in it's base, Islam is a peaceful religion and has conflicting passages as does Christianity.

The difference is, there are too many people in power in the Islamic world that have not gotten past the time of the crusades.

To deny this is to bury your head in the sand and deny reality.

There are great people in Muslim history and in the present. Unfortunately it's just like what you all claim to be the racism of the US. The minority seems to dictate the aura of the majority, on a deadly scale.
6/26/2009 9:33:24 PM   From:  MrsK   And when exactly (please quote for me) did I mention having support for ANYONE on either side? What I am arguing IWs is that people have this moronic habit of classifying ALL Muslims under one label. It would be like me saying that because Joe Biden is a Catholic, all Americans are idiots who don't eat meat on Sundays and force rape victims to carry pregnancies to full term.

I am sick of hearing the condescending bullshit about how Islam is hateful and spreads evil. Give it UP.

If you know it isn't true, don't go spreading it around like a gossip happy teenager.
6/26/2009 10:10:28 PM   From:  ImWithStupid   First off, I have never labeled all Muslims in any sort of way. Second, Catholics don't eat meat on Friday, and only during Lent.

(which is an outdated tradition started when the Catholic Church had large financial holdings in the fishing industry and wanted to make more money)

Damn Catholics.
6/26/2009 10:11:44 PM   From:  ImWithStupid   You however keep trying to compare the atrocities of Christianity from centuries ago, to the continued atrocities of radical Islam of today.
6/26/2009 10:14:06 PM   From:  ImWithStupid   Religious scriptures can be manipulated by many. Look at David Koresh, Jim Jones, etc...

It can happen to nearly any Religion.

Unfortunately, right now, in history, there is an overwhelming number of misguided radicals, killing innocent people, in the name of their "religion".

That would be radical Islam, regardless of the intent of the passages.
6/26/2009 10:25:31 PM   From:  MrsK   You seem to be missing a HUGE chunk of this discussion IWS. But I gotta run.
6/27/2009 12:58:56 AM   From:  whogo   Tell Neda about peaceful Islam...nevermind she's dead. 
6/27/2009 5:19:50 AM   From:  PapaBryant   "How many people were killed and tortured to convert to so-called Christianity or for simply being accused of not being for it?"

Now you know good and G_d damned well not to make an assinine statement like this around me.

The answer is 0.

Spanish Inquisition? That was Ferdinand and Isabella using allegiance to the King's faith as a test of allegiance to the Crown. Political manipulation and abuse of the Church.

Crusades? Every massacre of Jews that occured in the first, second and third Crusade was condemned by the Church and the leaders excommunicated (meaning the Church told those who murdered Jews if they failed to convert "Got to Hell. Literally."

Let me make this catagorically clear; there has NEVER been a systematic attempt by the Christian religion to force conversion.

Making a historically ignorant statement like that? Damn you would think people would learn.....
6/27/2009 5:44:09 AM   From:  PapaBryant   "The difference Chi. is that 1,500 years ago when people thought the world was flat Christians did indeed commit wars of conquest and atrocities on people. So did the Muslims of the time."


The difference is the sanctioning of it. The Catholic Church NEVER sanctioned the abuse of natives, or those of other religions. THe Crusades, far from being wars of conquest, were Christendom coming to the defense of fellow Christians in Constantinople - whom the Prophet Mohammed saw as the capital of the Roman Empire and prized it as a trophy to Allah.

K is right that the Qu'ran doesn't sanction murder. The problem (as I see it) is that as a document it gives the clerics too much leeway in interpretation, and it does allow for deception of Christians, Jews and those not of the Book in order to facilitate the eventual triumph of the umma. That is the reason 911 happened. BCAR is right that modern Muslim leaders have a 13th century outlook, thanks in part to the doctrine of "Two Truths" that constitutes Islamic government and gives political power to the clerics. However, Islamic government is actually not a true theocracy under the Two Truths doctrine - Iran is an aboration, and they are NOT Islamic fundamentalists, but radical reformers who are tired of the failure of the Caliphate/Sultanate in spreading the faith. The "crime" of al-Islam (and I hesitate calling it that K, but can find no more accurate word) is allowing the government, through NOT reining in the clerics, to sanction murder when convienent.

Christianity on the othre hand has always condemned murder, and those who would rationalize it. There have been warrior priests, Francis of Assisi comes to mind, but they have always followed Augustine rules of conflict - the very first attempt to regulate conduct in warfare by theology. When innocents have suffered as a result of Christian action, it has HISTORICALLY been the job of the Church to try and mitigate the suffering. What the Catholic Church can rightfully be accused of is not being a strong enough force at times to cause obstensibly "Christian" leaders to regulate their behavior - Charlemaigne didn't execute the Muslims he captured in Sardinia because the Church told him he would lose his soul, but Emicho of Flonheim, Hartmann of Dillingen, Drogo of Nesle, William the Carpenter, and Peter the Hermit all ignored Pope Urban II's direct order to leave the Jews alone. They didn't fear their souls.
6/27/2009 6:16:13 AM   From:  PapaBryant   "The act of murder is rampant in the Bible. In much of the Bible, especially the Old Testament, there are laws that command that people be killed for absurd reasons such as working on the Sabbath, being gay, cursing your parents, or not being a virgin on your wedding night. In addition to these crazy and immoral laws, there are plenty of examples of God's irrationality by his direct killing of many people for reasons that defy any rational explanation such as killing children who make fun of bald people, and the killing of a man who tried to keep the ark of God from falling during transport. There are also countless examples of mass murders commanded by God, including the murder of women, infants, and children."

Sigh.

1. Working on the Sabbath meant you were disobeying GOD'S laws, and for a tribal/religious government that ment you were a troublemaker. We can say TODAY that being an obstinate prick who rebels at authority isn't reason to be executed, but back then that could affect your survival and the survival of your people. You are judging this by modern standards not the standards of the day. Your objection is irrelevant for that reason.

2. Regardless of whether or not you are pro or anti gay rights, it is a medical fact that gays are generally speaking more suseptable to STD's than the general population. This was true before the AIDS crisis as well. This is because in male homosexuals sex delivers semen into the colon and small intestines, which has cells MEANT to absorb nutrients on the cellular level. Gays and those who engaged in bisexual sex, such as the Spartans of Greece, died at earlier ages than the rest of the population. If a man regularly slept with another man, he was also likely to take back to his family, to the mother of his children, the diseases he picked up. The Jews were the only people on Earth to prohibit men from engaging in sex with other men - as a hygene issue. HINT: Its also the same reason they prohibited temple prostitution.

3. Cursing your parents? See "Working on the Sabbath".

4. Not being a virgin on your wedding night? The provisions in biblical and cuneiform law collections dealing with the commission of a wrong typically list only the most severe penalty allowed by law and leave other possible penalties unmentioned. This is reflective of an error we have seen many times: Deuteronomy is not a literal handbook, but is really intended to be didactic - a book of case law.

The legal systems of the ANE allowed the same infraction to be punished with different penalties. The wronged party often had the right to choose which penalty or penalties to impose on the offending party. A husband who had been wronged by pre-consummation sex plus deception thus had a range of penalties from which to choose, including death, but also lesser penalties.

Why this would this be important? See the answer about "gay sex".

5. Make fun of a bald person? See 1 (after all he was God's chosen Prophet, how much more authority could he have?). Also since shaving one's head was a sign of mourning, these ANE-juvenile deliquents was engaging in an act of deliberate cruelty - the equivalent of Fred Phelps protesting dead Marines funerals.

6.This is the equivalent of a man being accidentally electricuted while working on his garbage disposal or garage door opener. He wasn't careful around somenthing very dangerous. Nothing more.

7.Mass-Murder? heheh, like the Cannanites? Read this: http://www.christian-thinktank.com/qamorite.html

Think they engaged in mass murder now?
6/27/2009 9:13:49 AM   From:  BCAR   Note to all muslim murderer apologists. Quote the Christian bible all you want. But WHO, yes WHO is out there killing people here today in the modern age? backward Muslims, that's who.
6/27/2009 3:42:10 PM   From:  emkay64   Holy Shnikes! I had to put on my reading glasses. This thing went epic!
6/27/2009 3:50:17 PM   From:  whogo   Tell Neda about peaceful Islam...nevermind she's dead. 
6/27/2009 4:56:05 PM   From:  mercury   Catholics don't eat meat on Friday ... or used to not eat meat on Friday. Rules have been loosened on that and it's now permissible.
6/27/2009 5:40:27 PM   From:  BCAR   You'd think that with the invention of the lighbulb even Muslims would realize it's better to come in out of the dark.
6/27/2009 8:46:51 PM   From:  whogo   Muslims stink. 
6/29/2009 7:32:54 AM   From:  MrsK   Maybe all you Christian apologists can explain all the religiously fed violence in Ireland then. I believe they were all rioting out in the streets just a few years ago also.
6/29/2009 7:54:42 AM   From:  BCAR    How many car bombs were there? Beheadings? Kidnaps? Murders? Acts of terrorism? Assasinations?
6/29/2009 8:19:15 AM   From:  MrsK   Lots of violence. Lots of deaths. But I guess that only counts if you're Muslim. My bad. *rolls eyes*
6/29/2009 8:42:40 AM   From:  BCAR   Try this for an exercise all can understand. For the next year stack one penny for each act of Christian violence. Then stack a separate pile of pennies for each Muslim act of violence.


See which one reaches the moon first.
6/29/2009 8:44:31 AM   From:  ImWithStupid   Actually, there were quite a few bombings, murders, assassinations and kidnappings in Ireland.

6/29/2009 8:45:52 AM   From:  MrsK   If fanatical Christian crimes were televised instead of swept under the rug it might actually be a fair experiment. But since everything on TV these days is slanted towards hating our latest target there really isn't any point.
6/29/2009 8:56:32 AM   From:  eddo   oh puhleeze....


the US media LOVES to bash all things Christian, and has for a long time now.
6/29/2009 9:20:18 AM   From:  MrsK   Really Eddo? And when was the last time you heard anything about N. Ireland? And how many televised representations of those public outcries from Christians against violence vs those from Muslims? Do you REALLY believe it is because Muslims aren't against or willing to speak out against the fantatics ruining their religious rep? You guys really do love to have your cake and eat it too.
6/29/2009 9:50:53 AM   From:  ImWithStupid   From: MrsK Really Eddo? And when was the last time you heard anything about N. Ireland?


Two days ago when two paramilitary groups proved they disarmed themselves as part of the peace process that's been going on for about a decade.
6/29/2009 10:00:07 AM   From:  BCAR   How about shutting your yap and start stacking those pennies. A year from now take a photo and post it here.

Note: You'll need a telephoto lens for the Muslim stack.
6/29/2009 11:59:54 AM   From:  Ali   ^^^ very true!
6/29/2009 1:33:25 PM   From:  LiquidSnake   Here's my 2 cents for this argument. Religion is stupid.
6/29/2009 1:38:07 PM   From:  eddo   well then, that settles everything.

no need to discuss anything ever again! thanks LiquidSnake!
6/29/2009 1:43:37 PM   From:  LiquidSnake   Your welcome
6/29/2009 6:20:23 PM   From:  PapaBryant   " Maybe all you Christian apologists can explain all the religiously fed violence in Ireland then."

You should know better than this; the break in Northern Ireland is not between "Protestants and Catholics" but between those who want to remain part of the UK and those who don't. The fact that MOST of those loyal to Britain are part of the Church of England doesn't mean there are no Catholics on the "Protestant" side, and vice versa.

This is NOT religious violence, but political. The news media has used the "religious" terms as a shorthand to identify the players. I hate to say this K, but you "drank the kool-aid" on this one.

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